Heart of the Matter from Salt Lake City

January 19th, 2010

LIVE! From the “Mecca of Mormonism,” Salt Lake City, Utah –

THIS is Heart of the Matter… “Where Mormonism Meets Biblical Christianity Face to Face.”

And I’m your host, Shawn McCraneyFounder of TGNN and developer of the fulfilled perspective—calling people to faith outside of religion.. If you have family or friends who cannot get Heart through television, give them a call and tell them to go to www.hotm.tv and they can watch through streaming video from anywhere in the world!

Upcoming Program and Celebratory Broadcast

Hey… “I was a Born-Again Mormon.” The manuscript is available online through a downloadable PDF. Go to www.hotm.tv and you can have the book in your hands within minutes.

How about joining a weekly verse by verseTGNN’s Bible teaching series—book-by-book, through the lens of fulfillment and spiritual liberty. never-denominational Bible Study? Join us at CAMPUS every Sunday at either Utah State in Logan or at the U of U in Salt Lake City. Go to www.calvarycampus.com for more information like times and directions.

Well, Heart of the MatterTGNN’s original show where Shawn McCraney deconstructed religion and developed fulfilled theology. Fans, this coming Tuesday, January 27th we will airing, God willing, our 200th program! We’ve never missed but for a family emergency and a station power outage. PRAISE GOD. And we thank you for playing such an important role.

Some of you have been with us from the start. Some started watching last week. You’ve put on your prayer lists, supported us financially, and told your family and friends about the ministry. The ministry has seen exponential world-wide growth and a truly miraculous harvest. Millions – MILLIONS – of people have tuned in (in one way or another) and tens of thousands have made personal decisions to seek the truth based off the information they’ve received. Because of God Great seeds have been sown.

Best of all, a large unknown quantity of souls have actually walked from Mormonism and into the arms of a saving relationship with Jesus Christ. We personally can account for many hundreds. In celebration of what the LORD has done, join us next week on Tuesday, January 27th right here at the studio for our 200th live broadcast, and then after the show, come on over to Squatter’s Pub for a reunion of the once popular Pastor in the Pub. It’ll be a great time to see all the old – and new – faces. That’s Tuesday, January 27th here at the studio, and then at Squatter’s Pub on 3rd and Main downtown afterward around 9:30. And with that, let’s have a prayer.

Discussion on Apostasy and Mormon Teaching

Central to the LDS teaching that Mormonism is “the only true Church on the face of the whole earth” is their faulty idea that a “Restoration” of the primitive Church of Jesus Christ had to occur because the Church Jesus established fell into a COMPLETE, world-wide state of apostasy. Everything the LDS do and believe grows up and out from this false teaching that Mormonism is Jesus' Church restored.

The Bible teaches two things quite plainly about apostasy. First, it teaches that there would be, and will continue to be, a number of ugly but partial “apostasies” and “falling away’s” within the Body of Christ throughout its history. Second, the Bible teaches that the Church Jesus established would wholly win against any and all apostasies, that even “the gates of hell” would not prevail against it – ever.

Where Christians know Jesus established His gospel and that it while it might struggle, it would continue, Mormons believe Jesus work was doomed and that a man named Joseph Smith had to come along to restore it. The topic of Apostasy is made all the more difficult due to the LDS claim that a non-existent “priesthood authority” was also lost along with the church Jesus established and that it, too, “needed to be restored.” This is absolutely counter to what the Bible says about priesthood – especially in the book of Hebrews.

Because of time constraints, however, we are going to talk specifically about “complete world-wide apostasy of the church Jesus” established and discuss the fallacious teaching on priesthood in September of this year.

Assertions by LDS Church Leaders

Speaking of this “world-wide apostasy,” 8th President of the LDS Church, Heber J Grant said:

10th LDS President Joseph Fielding Smith said:

12th President Spencer W. Kimball said:

15th President Gordon B. Hinckley said:

Now, Latter-day Saints strongly refute the idea that Joseph Smith merely “reformed” the church, but say that he actually had to restore it because it had totally lost its power, priesthoods, and way. Their own History of the Church states: (HotCOJCoLDS – 1-XL.)

“Nothing less than a complete apostasy from the Christian religion would warrant the establishment of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints… there was no possible excuse for the introduction.

The Origins of Mormon Views on Apostasy

When God supposedly told Joseph that all the churches were wrong, that all the Christian creeds on earth were an abomination to him, and that all the Christian professors of faith were corrupt, they meant it. Brigham Young said: “The Christian world, so called, are heathens as to their knowledge of the salvation of God.” McConkie said: “Mormons have the only pure and perfect Christianity on earth. All other systems of religion are false.”

The negative beliefs and statements about Christians and Christianity abound in Mormonism—from the pen of its founder to the mouths of sixty thousand plus full time missionaries to discussions that privately occur in LDS wards around the world. “Oh, no, we love everyone. We never attack another person’s faith.” Yeah, right.

Pre-Existing Factors Leading to Joseph Smith Jr.'s Claims

I would be negligent in our examination of “Apostasy” if we did not look at some of the pre-existing factors that lead Joseph Smith Jr. to claim that he, in fact, restored the true Church of Jesus back to the earth in 1830. Consider these factors when you try and understand what motivated the Man to say and do (what he said and did.)

Before Joseph Smith Jr. was born in the winter of 1805, the foundation for Mormonism was well established… in part by his paternal grandfather and father. His grandfather, whose name was Asael, was extremely opinionated on the subject of religion, and looked for the day when the “primitive Church would be restored back to the earth.” Joseph Smith’s own father ardently REFUSED—REFUSED—to ever join any religion because he felt they were “all wrong” and the true one needed to be restored.

Beliefs of the Smith Patriarchs

Additionally, the Smith patriarchs believed two very important things relative to what young Joseph Smith would ultimately propose. First, they believed that America was chosen by God as a land of liberty and that the true “Church of Jesus Christ” would some day be restored on this continent. The Smith patriarch’s were not alone in these beliefs—there were a whole bunch of men and women around at the time, who were known as “restorationists” or “primitivists,” who too were looking for the original church of Jesus Christ to be restored. In all probability the Body of Christ was going through an ugly period—as it is wont to do—and these people longed for a more genuine religious approach. I can see this even in this day and age.

This environment is one reason why self-proclaimed “religious revelators” like Ellen G. White, William Taze Russell, Mary Baker Eddie, and Joseph Smith Junior all started to sort-of pop up around the same time, each claiming a fresh new world view. LDS author Richard L. Bushman, in Joseph Smith and the Beginnings of Mormonism. (Urbana: University of Illinois Press, 1984), p. 34. stated that early Mormonism was known as a Cambellite sect, a name taken from Joseph Cambell who well before Smith sought to restore the primitive church to the earth too.

The second thing the Smith patriarch’s believed—even before Joseph was even born—was that this Church would be restored through the Smith family itself. George Q. Cannon, Church Apostle, writes in his book, Life of Joseph Smith the Prophet, that Joseph’s grandfather Asael said: “It has been bourne (sic) upon my soul that one of my decendents (sic) will promulgate a work to revolutionize the world of religious faith.”

History proves that from a very young age, Joseph Smith junior was taught that

The primitive religion of Jesus had been taken from the earth (meaning the gates of hell did in fact prevail against what the LORD set up)

That America was set apart for the “restored gospel” to come forth, and

That young Joseph would, in fact, be the one who would restore this true religion to earth.

With such soil under his feet, Joseph Smith Jun., was primed for founding a new religion almost from the grave. Everything about early Mormonism—the angelic visits, the Book of Mormon, the new revelations, the twists, and its strong attraction to people who were burned by the antics happening in traditional Christian churches—were fruit from the notion that Mormonism was indeed, the “restored Church.”

Very quickly Smith sensed the liberty that came with being a “restorationist” and began to take advantage of the trust people had in his visions. In time, he would become more and more aggressive in his assertions of what was actually part of this “restored gospel,” culminating in the fact that by the end of his life he

The Misinterpretation of Scripture

Thought nothing of secretly taking dozens of wives, of inserting his own name into the book of Genesis, and of even having himself ordained “King of the World.” (beat) And yet today millions continue to sing, “Praise to the Man.” LDS missionaries use the Bible to mislead unsuspecting and unlearned people on the idea that the church Jesus established failed – and was indeed restored by Smith. There are several key verses they use – out of context, of course. Let’s read them and see what they really mean and say!

Key Biblical Verses

Acts 3:20-21
And he shall send Jesus Christ, which before was preached unto you: Whom the heaven must receive until the times of restitution of all things, which God hath spoken by the mouth of all his holy prophets since the world began.

The LDS misrepresent this verse to mean that Jesus will not return to earth until there has been a “restitution of all things,” which they say is the LDS gospel and that this was prophesied since the world began. Wholly incorrect. Peter was speaking to whom? “The Men of Israel.” And a CENTRAL message of all Old Testament prophets was about Israel’s Restoration (see, Isaiah 40:9-11; Jeremiah 32:42-44; Ezekiel 37; Hosea 11; and Amos 9). This has NOTHING to do with a world-wide apostasy or the idea the Church Jesus established could not be trusted. Contextual readingReading Scripture with attention to its audience, setting, and purpose—essential to fulfilled understanding. of scripture reveals it.

Acts 20:29-31
For I know this, that after my departing shall grievous wolves enter in among you, not sparing the flock. Also of your own selves shall men arise, speaking perverse things, to draw away disciples after them. Therefore watch, and remember, that by the space of three years I ceased not to warn every one night and day with tears.

What is the context here? Paul is speaking to the elders in the church at Ephesus. And he is warning them about what is headed their way – in their respective church at Ephesus, NOT in the entire world! The pastoral epistles verify that Paul spoke prophetically.

The Gospel of Grace

Galatians 1:8
I marvel that ye are so soon removed from him that called you into the grace of Christ unto another gospel: Which is not another; but there be some that trouble you, and would pervert the gospel of Christ. But though we, or an angel from heaven, preach any other gospel unto you than that which we have preached unto you, let him be accursed.

First, what does this passage NOT say? It does NOT say anything about a world-wide apostasy. This is a letter to the Galatians. Come on! And the other Gospel – or the perversion on the true Gospel referred to what? BRINGING legalisms back into the Good news which added works to the Gospel of Grace, which was something some Judaizers did in response to the freedoms Paul taught that were found in Jesus Christ. According to Acts 15 and 20 these false teachers crept in and began to teach things that took them from the gospel of Grace.

Many false doctrines have been brought into the hearts of believers over the centuries. But the true church, made of faithful believers, has never been lost.

One of the BIGGIES the LDS use in scripture is found in 2nd Thessalonians 2:3.

Speaking of Jesus immediate return, Paul wrote:

“Let no man deceive you by any means: for that day shall not come, except there come a falling away first, and that man of sinMissing the mark of faith and love—no punishment, just lost growth or peace. be revealed, the son of perdition . . . .

Respected LDS Apostles like James Talmage have taken this passage and ridiculously said things like: “Here, Paul speaks of the iniquity already present in the church . . . foretelling the apostasy and the need for a restored church!”

It is amazing that intelligent LDS people will read commentary from men like this and because they call themselves Apostles they believe it! This passage is speaking of a very specific period of time, AN END-TIME PROPHECY – when there will be an apostasy, but not of the whole church! Paul prophetically reassures the people that Jesus will not be returning until . . . there come a falling away first, and that man of sin be revealed, the son of perdition . . . He is saying that Jesus will not come until there comes a falling away first WHEN the Anti-Christ is revealed . . . (And he describes him in the following verse . . .)

Who opposeth and exalteth himself above all that is called God, or that is worshipped; so that he as God sitteth in the temple of

Apostasy and the Continuity of the Church

God, shewing himself that he is God. Yes, this passage does refer to apostasy, but it is AN apostasy, at a time-specific place in history when the anti-Christ reveals himself. GOSH!

1st Timothy 4:1-2
Now the Spirit speaketh expressly, that in the latter times some shall depart from the faith, giving heed to seducing spirits, and doctrines of devils; speaking lies in hypocrisy; having their conscience seared with a hot iron;

Finally, we have 1st Timothy 4:1-2.

Now, notice that Paul didn’t write: “ . . . that in latter times all shall depart from the faith!” but instead wrote, “that in latter times some shall depart from the faith.” “Some, Francis, some!” Perhaps even more importantly is the context of this passage. Here Paul is addressing a specific kind of apostasy, one related to dualistic Gnosticism, which deals with the distinction between flesh and spirit. It has nothing to do with a whole church apostasy!

Refuting Claims of a Worldwide Apostasy

In addition to clarifying the Twists the LDS have done on these simple passages, there are a number of valid, contradictory elements found both in and outside which completely refutes the Mormon’s claims of a world-wide apostasy. First, think about their claim rationally. Why would Jesus come to earth, teach and train His apostles as firsthand witnesses to all He said and did, tell them to go forth unto all the nations, be martyred for it, only to have it all lost? And why would God allow the church to fall into complete apostasy after His only begotten Son established it ONLY to then completely protect it from wholesale apostasy because Joseph Smith supposedly restored it? It’s man-made idiocy, I tell you!

Then, what about the fact that God always having a remnant of true believers on earth? In the book, “The Blood-Line of the Church,” the author lays out a profound lineage of solid believers through thick and thin, through the Dark Ages, through times of revolt, through governmental influences and doctrinal disputations. God has always had the principle of remnant in His divine work. – From Noah and His family and the flood, to grapes on the vine to wheat in the field for the Children of Israel. From the Babylon captivity, to the struggling Christians.

Scriptural Support for Church Continuity

What supports this? How about statements from scripture itself? Jesus said to Peter, “I will build my church and the gates of hell will not prevail against it!” He said to His followers, “Lo, I am with you always, even to the end of the world!” He promised that where “two or three are gathered together in my name, there am I in the midst of them.” Just two or three believers on earth, and He is in the midst? That may be a very weak force, but that is all Jesus said was necessary.

In Ephesians 3:21 Paul says: “Unto him be glory in the Church by Christ Jesus THROUGHOUT THE AGES, world without end?” How could God be glorified throughout the ages if His church fell into total darkness? Ephesians 4 describes the Church Jesus established GROWING in SPIRITUAL MATURITY NOT into spiritual degeneracy? Explain this? The Apostle Peter said that: “The word of the Lord endureth forever” – FOREVER! – and he adds, “and this is the Word which by the gospel is preached unto you.” The writer of Hebrews wrote that: “We receiving a kingdom which cannot be moved!” Sound like a church founded on sand or Jesus, the eternal, unmovable rock?

The Book of RevelationA symbolic prophecy fulfilled in 70 A.D.—not a prediction of future global events. describes seven churches of the early Church, which are also pictures for the epochs of time in the Body of Christ following Jesus' ascension. What are they and what do they mean?

In Revelation 1:11, Jesus Christ Himself says to John the Beloved: “I am Alpha and Omega, the first and the last: and, What thou seest, write in a book, and send it unto the seven churches which are in Asia; unto Ephesus, and unto Smyrna, and unto Pergamos, and unto Thyatira, and unto Sardis, and unto Philadelphia, and unto Laodicea.” And then He goes on to describe these seven churches, which, remember, picture the periods of time the Christian church would endure until His return. Let me hit on them quickly, which perfectly, and prophetically detail the trials the Christian church would endure.

The important thing to notice here is THE CHURCHES NEVER GO AWAY. Do they have trouble? Sure. BUT they NEVER, EVER disappear.

So first there was . . .

Ephesus:

Smyrna:

Pergamos:

Thyatira:

Sardis:

Philadelphia:

Laodicea:

David Reed and John Farkas, as quoted in a great book by Ron Rhodes called Reasoning from the Scriptures with the Mormons, said:

(page 59)

Do we trust what scripture calls His

Gospel Authenticity

Is He the author and finisher of our faith – or is Joseph Smith? Was more Gospel needed? More additions? How come Jesus didn’t speak of the “temple endowment?” How come Jesus didn’t tell us about celestial marriage?

The Unchanging Gospel

My friends, there was NO world-wide apostasy. The gospel Jesus Christ gave to the world was never lost. Believers, true and faithful believers, have kept it alive and going since the ascension. This is one of the great miracles of Christianity. And the myths of Joseph Smith were introduced to bring him power, glory, and gold.

Contact Information

With that, let’s open up the phone lines: (801) 973-8820 (801) 973-TV20

While we wait, let’s take a look at a NEW spot about an important part of our ministry. RUN SPOT FOR PARTNERS PARTNERS SPOT EMAILS EMAILS EMAILS EMAILS?

Conclusion: Next week? Apostles!

And remember, it’s OUR 200th show! Join us here for an in-studio celebratory show and then afterward at Squatter’s Pub for a commemorative Pastor in the Pub!

See you next week, here, on Heart of the Matter.