Live from the Mecca of Mormonism

Salt Lake City THIS is heart of the matterTGNN’s original show where Shawn McCraney deconstructed religion and developed fulfilled theology. Where we are learning together how to live as Christians in the age of fulfillment

And I’m your host, Shawn McCraneyFounder of TGNN and developer of the fulfilled perspective—calling people to faith outside of religion.

Let’s begin with a word of Prayer

Show 17B Follow-Up to Family Deaths Taped Tuesday March 14th 2020

Reflections on Recent Events

So last night we aired a show about deathSeparation from God—now overcome. Physical death remains, but it no longer separates us from life with God. – and how in the age of fulfillment Christians ought to see, and respond to the death of believers and the deaths of those loved-ones and friends who passed without faith. We will get to your comments on that show in a moment but first let’s hit the comments on last weeks live show called, Religious Manipulations where we covered the most repulsive parts of the recent LDS General Conference, especially their changed logo and the prophet leading the members into something that they call the Hosanna Shout.

I was sort of taken back by the response because by the next day we had a thousand views, which is a lot of us, and a lot for us that fast. We also received a number of your comments – which we will get to in a minute as well. First, something I failed to mention on the review of the Hosanna Shout. Years ago we had some friends who had a neighbor that worked in the offices of the First Presidency for the Mormon Church. We asked her what it was like. As background information she was pro-LDS and what she shared was not said as a slam but was said with pride.

What she told us was that the floor operates on a standard of perfection. “What does that mean?” I asked and she said that errors and mistakes were not tolerated. That there was a high expectation for doing everything right, from typos and grammar to catering – “everything,” she said with a gleam in her eye had to be perfect.” I’ve long thought about her description – and how for me it was a definition of hell. But I was also amazed that the woman herself didn’t mind the ambiance or the pressure that came with it. In my opinion, we actually get a slight insight or glimpse into the expected perfection that goes on at the top in the demonstration of their Hosanna Shout.

Observations on Leadership

Maybe you caught it too. Russ Nielson embarks on sharing the way to do it with the viewing audience, and when he starts a swinging, the camera pulls back and shows his two counselors, Dallin Oakes and Jeffery Holland swinging away too. Now, at first, they are all sort of in sync, but watch Dallin Oakes who sort of slips off into his own little rhythm and blues, and this “independence and failure to follow the prophet” causes Russell to actually look over his left shoulder to see what the heck is going on! Take a look!

SHOW THE SCENE HERE

Now, I could be wrong – maybe the prophet seer and revelator of the Lord in this dispensation was just trying to look over at his out of step counselor to kind of give him a smile or nod, but I don’t think so. I know an RN who works in a place that Old Russell Nelson frequents for reasons I have been asked to not make known as she fears for her job. On one occasion Russ was in the same room with her and in a free moment she choose to ask him a question outside of her job and in line with the Church. The man rudely and angrily shut her and her question down.

Maintaining Love and Acceptance

Now, I don’t know about you, but it seems to me that a prophet of the Lord, since Jesus has already set the stage for love, and kindness, and gentleness and mercy, would be just that. Not so, say my first hand witnesses. And because of this I doubt very much that he was looking over at old off timing Oakes with love, but instead consternation. It just didn’t look good to have them so out of sync . . . did it?

So with reference to last weeks show and the number of people who watched it and responded, I want to make something really clear: I love, and I accept all people of all walks of life on this earth – taken by themselves. I believe that this is a call on my life as a follower of the King. And that love IS defined by the fruit of the Spirit and on how Paul describes it

Critique of Religious Institutions

In 1st Corinthians 13.

I therefore refuse to be impatient, unkind, unmerciful, rough, short, or any of those other things of the flesh toward them. However, I do not play by the same rules when it comes to religious institutions or the people who represent them. This was the same with the Lord Jesus Christ who I personally seek to follow. He was able to hang with publicans and sinners and the diseased and wretched, and to love and serve them, but when it came to the religionists of His day, those men who represented themselves as having authority over others, our Lord did not hold back. I hope these differences are clearly observed here on the show today. My wars are never against individuals – they are always against religious institutions, in Jesus name, and those men and women who shamefully represent them in ways that are opposite than the ways of our Lord. They are the vipers, the hypocrites, the children of hell, whited sepulchers full of dead men's bones, men whose father is the father of lies, people who seek to make merchandise of others . . . men who do all things to be seen of men.

Characteristics of Hypocrites

Love the chief seats in the churches, who loved to be called Bishop, Pastor, Reverend or Prophet in the marketplaces . . . These are the hypocrites who make long prayers, and devour widows' houses; who strain at gnats but omit the weightier things of God like love and kindness . . . These are full of extortion and excess and are full of all uncleanness. Outwardly they appear beautiful but inwardly they are full of iniquity. These same men garnish the tombs of the prophets but if they were alive in their day they would have contributed to their deaths. In Jesus' day he asked of them, “How would they ever escape the judgement of hell?” Such are not just the LDS leaders, friends, they are hunkered down behind the golden altars of religion everywhere.

To any such as themselves I have zero respect, tolerance or allegiance. To them and them alone I will speak straightly. The rest of you I love, accept and pray – knowing that it is only by such that the truth will ultimately be known.

Comments from Last Weeks Live Show

wrenchlix
I thought their hosana shout was more like waving the white flag of surrender (to go along with the fasting) because they have no answers for the coronavirus.

Huff Humble responded
wrenchlix weak Considering the company your in ? This show is about love Not your ego

TheMegaafroman
I still wonder if Shawn converted John Offalon years ago?? Thankyou Shawn for helping me years ago, i was a few days from being totally into the mormon teachings and baptized by them. I had a christian background and was already a believer in jesus but If it weren't for your lessons, facts and teachings i would not have been able to defend myself and keep myself from being indoctrinated into the mormon church. That was in 2013, its been over 7 years since then and I still think about that stuff and what would or could have happened to me. Thanks again if you do read this. -Fea

Mediation Music
I'm researching this white handkerchief ritual, does it link to the the masons?

Vanessa Braga
Seth didn't cut out Mr. Johnson.

HOWARD KING
Let’s face it, it’s all about their false pride and filthy lucre!

Vanessa Braga
Well the Mormon Jesus is indecent. He is showing his nipple and isn't wearing his garment. Imagine showing up on Sunday with a shirt so low your nipple shows. You can say I'm trying to be like Jesus! Even their logo goes against their standards. How do they get away this?

Tonya Rodgers replied
I was thinking the same thing when I saw this new icon.

Dean Medcalf added
lol face palm

3 Itty Bitty Piggies Story Time
but, the ever-changing never-changing god. Yeah, that's the ticket!

joan lantis
I heard it put this way by a catholic "do you love 'God' enough to sacrifice your life by going to mass? that is fine, BUT, WOULD YOU KILL to go to mass." and that's what we have to ask ourselves about going to any church meeting.

JDUB
Seth’s revenge. Creative editing. Good job sir.

Deb Delves
I really like your teaching shows. Please keep doing this. I'm am an X Mormon. My faith crisis was deep. I found truth in the Bible and comfort in finding Jesus and truth. I became a truth seeker after my crisis. Your show matters!

Me Too
Nelson is creepy just one rung below.

Core Reactions to the Show

Expressions from the Audience

Kenneth Copeland but steady making ground.

Jack Dawson I have to say it’s pretty nice to see Shawn’s “fangs” come out a little bit towards The Mormon Church, & rightfully so. Just when I thought this show couldn’t get any better or more daring, this episode airs. Great words. Great work. Great show

Dean Medcalf Monty python and the Hosanna Shout from the lds

Denae Hansen They should replace their picture of Jesus with one of their savior Joseph Smith in their name and logo. The "logo" of true followers will always be Christ and Him crucified, the cross, which Mormons find very offensive. It's a cult! Send your money! Thanks Shawn!

Lori Neilson The word? Ministers? More deceit from the change with the times church.

NightmareEntity The way you speak about social media so true, people have gone crazy

Kaitlyn Lee I absolutely LOVE that you Shawn came out of the cult of the LDS church, deconstructed all that false doctrine and came to the true authentic faith which was a gift given to you by the real Jesus Christ. You say it like it is, your honesty is inspiring. I could listen to you talk all day about the heart of the matter, the stuff that so many people crave. Like honestly, it's no surprise people want to grow in faith in the institutional church but tend to "backslide" in faith. They're doubting it for a reason!! Because it's not AUTHENTIC. It's NOT RELEVANT. Maybe god is teaching them to let go of the doubts!! I'm gonna listen to more of your videos. From Kait in New Zealand!

Larry Freestone Yes!!!!

Tonya Rodgers Thank you for sharing the truth Shawn Tonya Rodgers My brother who is Mormon was excited to share with me that President Neilson promised that if everyone join in prayer on Good Friday then Heavenly Father would take away the corona virus. I hope God exposes them for their deceit and manipulations.

Evidence of Initiatives and Promotions

Robert Hasse Though I have no dog in the Mormon vs traditional Christian fight, an interesting feature of the Mormon invitation that you displayed is that, in addition to not identifying themselves as LDS, their link includes "chruchofjesuscrhist" but no mention of "Latter-Day Saints."

3 Itty Bitty Piggies Story Time Hosanna shout with a kleanex to ward off Covid? Covid is a cult too, on steroids. Cult 2.0. Even the official first vision version alone proves itself totally contradictory and impossible. The Profit changes a logo, as a merchandising act? But, that Most Hole-y Profit has nothing on the Covid-Cult which will $ave and thus own ewe all through it's own "miracles" of fake, monopoly "medicine." The Heaven's-Gates Cult led by Bill Gates is more popular than Jesus now ("Please $ave us, Bill!"), and many seek $alvation through Bill with a virus and "cure" to unite and $ave the world as one, granted only by a new $avior Bill Gates. See ewe behind the comet/vaccine. Lying for the Dark Lord Gates. Most don't even recognize a cult if it isn't religious. Group $avation or bust!? Damn, sounds a bit like Saintn's Plan, on steroids? Hey, must be totally legit since the new $alvation-Cult follows the BITE Model Cult tactics/rules right down the line. Keeping up with the Gateses. Aren't Profits just great? BTW, my current designing of my next bumper sticker is likely to be: (on and elongated Chinese flag background) "Proud Parent of Covid-Cult Honor Student!" or maybe, "True LDS Values – the Covid-Cult – support LDS investments." Gates and his Covid-Cult are a sign of the new age of Aquarius (time to get hosed by the water bearer).

Tom great video keep up the amazing work

Kara Pendleton I am so glad you did this show. Monson always creeped me out but Nelson gives me a powerful snake vibe. He gets praised for all the changes he's making. Let's review them. Focused on deceiving people into thinking they are Christian, which would be blasphemous in the context of the first vision and origin story. THE CHURCH was started because God allegedly called Christianity abhorrent. It is therefore supposed to be other than, different from, above. It is also allegedly led by God via His prophet. So The Mormon god now likes Christianity and wants his "restored" church to be part of it … to look like it and act like it? Guess an indecisive, mind-changing god is what you get when he was not always a god but a man first. Keep up the great work, Shawn and team!

Han Räddas This reminds me of PAY LAY ALE.

MacKenzie Christy Mitt

Reflections on Religious Practices

Andrea Thomas: I thank you for exposing this false teaching for what it is! I could not believe that the LDS publicly showed this on conference TV! Years ago, when I went to my first temple dedication, it was the first and only time I had ever heard or seen any such handkerchief wave, which was just as foreign/weird as going to the temple for the first time! I had always believed it was "sacred" to the event of temple dedication. Now they are exposing it to all through conference? How strange, they are simply showing who they truly are, deceitful, false teachers!

Kellie P.: Seth musta forgot to cut out Mr Jhonson?!?! MsJohn1972: Hi Shawn, thank you for speaking up against this evil cult. I am very comfortable comparing the tactic they use to Adolf's tactics. Give people a uniform, give them a chance to climb up in their pride, become something, earn respect, and gain stripes on their shoulder, feeding pride. My toenails curl up listening to their twisted arguments—brainwashed at its finest. Can you also explain more about what the missionary life looks like? In terms of total control, like dress codes and handbooks?

Observations on Leadership and Symbolism

J. Huff Humble: I don’t know why they have a new logo. I know PAUL said he was all things to all people to convert, so that’s what I think the intention is as far as I can tell? I know too many people over a fifty-year span that loved Christ and gave their lives to preaching the gospel! Look at Boyd K. Packer— I watched him go from vibrant and healthy to an individual man sucking on an oxygen tank. To do what, twist his evil mustache and set up dark strategies for cash ? No way! I’ve watched too many apostles and people bear testimony and wither away loving Christ and bearing testimony of our savior Jesus Christ! It seems pretty simple to me: Jesus Christ and why we are here, period! Love & Peace ??????

Jeremiah: I want a copy of that logo with the bag of money! I can't find it anywhere else on the web. NightmareEntity: Wtf are you doing at the start scratching yourself? Han Räddas (edited): Mormonism claims it "restored the Gospel." Joseph Smith did NOT change a single word of the Gospel of 1 Corinthians 15:1-4, and merely changed some punctuation marks. Further, where is FIRST PRESIDENCY in the Bible? Nowhere. The Mormons today have 15 "apostles." Not even the Book of Mormon has 15 apostles, it only has 12 "disciples." And yet, this is all part of the "restoration." Bah!

Joseph Smyth: I gotta an idea of a logo. Bull Religion of the LAttEr DaY JerKs. K Sladerock: That snot rag waving video was absolutely ridiculous. Do u think the LDS leaders consciously know they are using God's name in vain?

Understanding Religious Expressions

Patrick Leyerle: This is so not biblical. They shout Hosanna to God and the Lamb for Joseph Smith. Oh, how they don't understand what Hosanna means. When Jesus rode on a donkey in Jerusalem, people had palm leaves and shouted Hosanna to Jesus. They wanted to make Jesus King, but it was not his time. Hosanna means save now or come save. Now you can know what the crowd was asking a humble king on a donkey in Jerusalem some 2000 years ago. What the Mormon church is doing is mockery. I will never shout Hosanna in memory or praise of anyone except to the True and Living God Christ the Almighty!

COMMENTS FROM LAST NIGHT'S SHOW ON DEATH IN THE AGE OF FULFILLMENT

TheProfit MoeHamHead: Oh my… I can't believe what I am hearing here. So… I'm going to Joann Fabrics to buy me some purple silk material to make a cape and get ready to be caught up into the tail of the Atlas Comet on May 20th!!! Later… CRAZY BABY!!!

2

MsJohn1972: Hi Shawn, did I miss you backing up your view about Jesus' return in 70AD in the past? Where or how can I find your reasoning? It's somewhat new of a course. Thanks. Joseph Morgan: Amen brother, amen!

Adnan Albeitawi: The day before this episode aired, my wife's uncle unexpectedly passed away. A few years ago my younger brother unexpectedly passed away at 28 years old. We mourned and grieved as most would, but their passing, when understood through the lens of…

Spiritual Understanding of Life and Death

Fulfillment is bitter-sweet. You see, they didn't die. At least, not in the biblical sense. What do I mean by that? As far back as Adam in the garden, death has never meant physical death. Yes, their flesh decayed and eventually died after eating of the fruit, but I think that was as a result of being cut off from the tree of Life; but when God told them they would die the very same day that they break his command, he was talking of a spiritual death. Even Jesus, throughout the book of John, referred to life and death in a spiritual sense; rarely, if ever, can one associate the word death, as used by Jesus in the book of John, to mean physical death. In fact, when Jesus did refer to someone who was physically dead, he often said they were "asleep." What I'm saying is, God and Jesus do not view "physical death" as being Death in the same way they don't view physical "life" as being Life. So maybe we shouldn't view it that way either. We know, as Christians, that following Christ is freedom from bondages of all kinds. And we also know, through Christ's FINISHED work, that he conquered death, and death is no more.

Freedom Through Christ

Knowing these things, we can conclude that when our bodies die, we are not dead. In fact saying this person died or that person died, is incorrect and an oxymoron. So it is: they have not died, but have been set free. Set free from what? Set free from their flesh which is of this world. Their flesh which was always at war with their spirit. Their flesh which wanted to hate when our spirit told us to love, the flesh which insatiably lusts, and desires, and wants more, more, and more. The flesh which gets addicted and easily corrupted by things; which gets old, gets sick, and which decays. They have been set free from all those things which the flesh IS, and are free from all those things that hinder us from following and loving God perfectly and from experiencing his perfect freedom. So their passing is bitter-sweet. Bitter because we miss them deeply, but sweet because they are free. In fact, they are more free than any of us can ever know in this flesh. Our flesh is the final chain that Christ breaks that truly makes us free in Him. And when our flesh dies, we can rejoice because NOW we are truly free in Him. That is the hope we have by and through Jesus. That is the hope the world has, but ESPECIALLY those who believe in Jesus. Being a Christian, gives us a taste of freedom while in this flesh. More importantly, we Christians have the hope of perfect freedom, in the presence of perfect Love, in the spiritual bodies that await us.

Dealing with Death

Common Sense Christianity It’s hard to deal with death. From my experience it’s probably the number 2 reason why people become atheist. They become mad at God for taking their loved one away. We must always remember that God feels our pain. He had to watch his son suffer and die. Instead of hating God for death you should rejoice in the fact that your loved one is in a better place and that God gave you that time to be with them.

Rog Michael If everyone is going to heaven and there is no longer any Hell what does Matthew 7:21-23 mean when Jesus says “Not everyone who says to me Lord Lord will enter the kingdom of heaven” and depart from me I never knew you?

M H I experienced what some call a NDE That's my preface to what I'm about to write here. If any of this does not line up with the Bible I would like to know. If it does line up with the Bible, I'd like to know which eschatologyStudy of “last things”—TGNN teaches all biblical eschatology was fulfilled in 70 A.D. More it fits with most. I am convinced that when we depart we leave our body immediately, and are freed from all the concerns and the constant input bombarding our physical senses. I think God is that golden life giving light people describe seeing… I think Jesus is who you stand before, and it's essentially the same as standing before God. I think there's a book, or books, involved. I think after someone departs, one of the only reasons they would even want to come back, would be that after being released from all of the concerns, and push and pulls on

Reflecting on the Gift of Time

The flesh, and after seeing everything down here the way it really is, and seeing their lifetime and what they'd done with it, they realized how much of what they lived for that seemed so important was of no eternal value… And they experience regret for wasting the gift of time they were given, and even fear of God in the reviewing of their stewardship of the gift of time that they had been given. That they realize God was lovingly there the whole time, arms open, waiting for them to look up for guidance, to do what He had set out for them to do… And know that it would be worth postponing the indescribable freedom and bliss, to be back in the body to do what God has set out for them to do… and to point others to look to God so that they also wouldn't waste all of their time focused horizontally… and to tell others about God.

God's Plans for Individuals

I think God has specific purposes and plans for individuals that He can guide and help them to accomplish if they'll look to Him and trust and walk by faith and not by sight alone. I do think there is a place for people who would trade the truth for lies, who's "god" is something else like fame or fortune etc. Fire and pitchforks in that place? I'm inclined to think it might be more like… being forced to eat your favorite food beyond the point of being so full that you're sick (as an analogy). I think if you have regard for what God thinks, then you can avoid that trap. And I'm not saying there's a long checklist to earn your way into acceptance by God. I think the only reason any of us can be acceptable to God is because of what Jesus accomplished. It's more like do you love God… or something else more. Beyond that I think it's more about trading time for eternally valuable things or temporally valuable things, and the former requires looking to Him and walking by faith. I also like your view of it being a city with open gates, but the ones outside of it just don't want to come in. Like they'd rather have what they perceive as desirable outside of the city.

Personal Testimony and Belief

Laura Odle 7 hours ago (edited)
You can't imagine how much pain, sorrow and grief that I've endured with the death of several family members, including my husband and friends. Most died without knowing Jesus. My thinking was that they didn't make it to heaven. There were times I wish I could have stayed working instead of becoming an end-of-life caretaker. It wasn't until you went into a different teaching of the Bible, that I really wanted to believe what you were saying about this new approach to God's Word. I've been through the deaths of children, suicides, and terrible terminal illnesses. Some had 'good deaths'; others not. When I asked Pastors, priests, and members, I was told that they are in hell. You're either in heaven or hell. Or purgatory. I stopped attending any church. I've discussed this with a few close friends. Only one believes that there is no hell. She's a believer and has never attended a church in her life. The other who does attend church believes in hell. This is what she said to me: If it sounds too good to be true, then it's probably a not." I want so much to believe they are happy wherever they are after they left this earth. My sorrow was lifted, yet there are times that I'll hear in my mind; "if it sounds too good to be true, it probably isn't.

Thank you, Shawn for lifting some of this sorrow and sadness from my heart. God bless you all.