From Mormonism to Biblical Christianity

Overview of Heart of the Matter

“LIVE FROM THE MECCA OF MORMONISM”

• SALT LAKE CITY UTAH –

This is Heart of the MatterTGNN’s original show where Shawn McCraney deconstructed religion and developed fulfilled theology., where Mormonism Meets Biblical Christianity, face to face.

Show 31 361 Five Point Calvinism Part I
September 24th 2013

And I’m your host Shawn McCraneyFounder of TGNN and developer of the fulfilled perspective—calling people to faith outside of religion.. We praise the True and Living God for allowing us to participate in this ministry. May He be with you (and us) tonight.

Are you interested in learning the Word verse by verseTGNN’s Bible teaching series—book-by-book, through the lens of fulfillment and spiritual liberty.? We invite you to go to our website at www.c-a-m-p–u-s.com and take advantage of our recorded verse by verse teachings through the Bible. Also, if you live in the Salt Lake area and do not attend a Bible teaching church consider joining us on Sunday’s either at 10 am for MILK or 2:30 pm for Meat.

The Importance of Teaching the Word

Listen – this is gonna sting a bit – going to church that does NOT teach the Bible is like going to a library that doesn’t have books, like going to a restaurant that doesn’t have food, like going to a movie that doesn’t have a projector. Essentially it’s a waste of time.

Why? Human’s please God by faith. We have victory over this world by faith. We remain in the vine by faith… AND FAITH COMES BY HEARING THE WORD. No or little hearing the word, no or little faith. Talk to your pastor about it if he isn’t feeding you the Word of God.

Responding to Critics

I suppose that more and more we are going to receive email like this one, which came all the way from the United Kingdom and is from Greg R.

“I left the Mormon church after 11 years. I was a convert here in the UK. I hated the whole Mormon temple experience. But as a gay man why is it that you appear to sound quite homophobic at times. It’s for this reason I don’t attend a Christian church. I think you’re fantastic though, Shawn.”

I wrote the following back to Greg:

“My brother Greg,

I want you to know that the application of the term homophobic is unfair; I would liken it to the LDS who call me an "anti-Mormon" because I challenge their faith. Terms and words, and the use of them, is important and so I want to explain myself to you as a means to refute the application of the term "homophobic" to my person and to show you that calling homosexual activity a sinMissing the mark of faith and love—no punishment, just lost growth or peace. no more makes me homophobic than my saying Mormonism is not Christian makes me anti-Mormon.

Sin and Christian Teachings

Now, I love homosexual people – I enjoy their company and the diversity with which many of them present themselves. We have homosexuals who attend our church services and activities in the ministry. Open, married homosexuals by the way. But the fact that I love them, and enjoy their company, and that they are welcome to any and all functions of Alathea Ministries, in no way can (or ever will) change the fact that homosexual activities are sinful. Does admitting this biblical fact make me homophobic? No, it makes me a Bible believing Christian, Greg.

Is your homosexuality any less sinful than my lustful feelings for women? No. It your homosexuality more sinful than my heterosexual temptations? Again, no. Sin is sin – and we all have it. Your not being able to attend a Christian church because the pastor teaches that homosexuality is a sin is like liars not attending because the pastor says lying is a sin, and adulterers not attending because the pastor says adultery is a sin.

Why do you get a pass on your sinful nature but adulterers and pedophiles and liars and thieves don't get a pass on theirs? We are all born into sin, Greg. And you have a lot more issues with sin than just your homosexuality. I could care less that you are personally and sexually attracted to men – but I could NOT possibly care more about your place and standing with God. And for that standing to be in good order, you have to admit your sinful nature (whatever it is) to God, receive the offering of His Son's shed blood, and deal with your damn gayness as a Christian – not as a homosexual trying to change the Christian rules! Get it?

I love you AS YOU ARE. And as far as I'm concerned what you are is between you and God. But you have to humble yourself before the King and receive His…

Homosexuality and Sin

In light of the whole homosexual thing and the rest of the sin we deal with as human beings, I think it is really, really important to remember that this world fell into condemnation at the onset, that God so loved the world He gave His only begotten Son to save it, and that by looking to Him in faith we may escape condemnation and be saved. That’s it folks.

Hey, we could use your support if you are in a position and as God so leads. In view of this check this out.

Our brother John out in Southern CA tells me that we need to keep new things popping up on www.HOTM.tv in order for people to return. One thing we are working on doing is getting the shows updated more quickly. And we have made some progress achieving this goal. Additionally, we are in the process up putting eight five minute segments that answer the most frequently asked questions by people who are coming out of Mormonism. Questions about how to deal with family, if the Bible can be trusted, how to know truth from deception, and what is the best approach when talking with LDS missionaries. Check it all out as we update and continue to improve at www.hotm.tv

The Concept of the Kingdom of Christ

And with that, how about a moment “From the Word?” There is a concept that is tossed about in Christian circles and not always agreed upon – the Kingdom of Christ. Some say it is something to come. Some say it is already here. I agree with the latter. Within Christianity, understanding the biblical teaching is important because it helps us come to grips with what life here on earth will be and look like for believers.

In other words, if His Kingdom is here we are not working toward getting it here, or preparing the earth to receive it. It exists in the lives of believers. Additionally, a belief either in the presence or absence of it plays heavily into believers' eschatological stance – and what they think about the end times and how they respond to it. In the Mormon/Christian debate, I think understanding the distinction is essential as we’ll see in just a minute.

In Paul’s epistle to the believers at Colosse, he wrote some things that give insight into the subject of the Kingdom of Christ. Listen closely as he says:

Insight from Colossians

Colossians 1:12
Giving thanks unto the Father, which hath made us meet to be partakers of the inheritance of the saints in light:
13 Who hath delivered us from the power of darkness, and hath translated us into the kingdom of his dear Son:
14 In whom we have redemption through his blood, even the forgiveness of sins:
15 Who is the image of the invisible God, the firstborn of every creature:
16 For by him were all things created, that are in heaven, and that are in earth, visible and invisible, whether they be thrones, or dominions, or principalities, or powers: all things were created by him, and for him:
17 And he is before all things, and by him all things consist.

From this, we can see we have been – not are going to be, not are waiting to be, but have been translated into the Kingdom of God’s dear Son. I want you to really try and get this image into your head – that as believers in Him you have, once and for all, been translated into the Kingdom of His Son.

What does this look like? What does this mean? I would suggest a couple of things – especially relative to the LDS/Christian debate. First, as members of His kingdom, we are not part of this world. Jesus made it clear that His kingdom is NOT of this world. Standing before Pilate, before His brutal deathSeparation from God—now overcome. Physical death remains, but it no longer separates us from life with God. by crucifixion, He PLAINLY stated (in John 18):

“My kingdom is not of this world: if my kingdom were of this world, then would my servants fight, that I should not be delivered to the Jews: but now is my kingdom not from hence.”

Now since His true believers are present members of His kingdom while here on earth, and since His kingdom is NOT of this world, it helps us to understand some of the descriptions about what being a Christian here will look like, doesn’t it?

For instance, 2nd Timothy 3:12 says:
“Yea, and all that will live godly in Christ Jesus shall

The Kingdom's Perspective on Worldly Establishments

We know that that operations and power of wealth and the machinations of men in high places, of retribution, and retaliation, are not how we operate – but by love, forgiveness, and refusing to implement the things of the world. For OUR kingdom is not of this world.

Anyone who understands Mormonism – the writers, and scholars, and historians – whether LDS or not, will readily admit that one thing Joseph sought to do was to bring heaven down here to earth in every way possible. We see his desire played out today in the manner and attitude in which the LDS do things – everything is done very well in terms of material application – which for them are their best representations of the kingdom on high.

Contrasting Views of the Kingdom

But Christ presented a very different picture. His kingdom is spiritual, and not of this world, and is founded on principles of ignobility (not earthly nobility), on the weak things of the world (not the strong) the failures on earth (not the successful) and the humble things of the world (not the proud and haughty). Where the Son of Man had no place to rest His head the LDS promote and gush all over themselves about the places they have built to lay their heads. Where Jesus was despised and rejected of Men the LDS seek for the acceptance of Man. Where as a true prophet Jesus had no respect in his own country their false prophet are raised, and revered in his own home town. And where Jesus eschewed politics the LDS from the top are steeped in political alliances.

His Kingdom reigns, my friends, in the hearts of those who love, honor, and follow Him and Him alone – no one else. Try and see through the counterfeit systems of religion – Mormonism included that seek to surreptitiously inject themselves in on His turf.

And with that. Let’s have a word of prayer.

A Study of Five Point Calvinism

Tonight we are going to embark on our study of Five Point Calvinism and how Mormon doctrine is essentially a refutation of it – which, in my opinion, is one of the reasons why Mormonism is so appealing to thinking individuals who seek to know and understand the true and living God. What I mean by this is Mormonism offers a “counterfeit of appealing man-made answers for people who cannot rationally accept Calvin’s presentation of what the Bible says.

This series is going to take some time – several weeks – and I intend on approaching it with as much biblical ammunition as possible. Here’s the deal – and I really hope you will listen closely to my assessment before accepting or rejecting it out of hand.

We all have a choice to make when it comes to the doctrine and theology we will embrace. Some people will argue that they ONLY accept what “God has said” – but in the end, or when challenged, this stance is often proven to fail. Instead, what they are claiming is to believe only what “they believe or want” God to say. The import of a sound contextual understanding of scripture is vital to preventing private interpretation.

Along the same lines there are people who will say, “I’ve gotta see that in the Bible before I’m gonna believe it” – but again, we often find that they only see what they want to see in the Bible – and refuse to explore the possibilities and potentialities that are also present therein. I’ve run into this time and time again with otherwise sound Christians. They have firmly built a camp on a foundation of religious tradition and when actually shown what the Bible is really saying refuse to pull up stakes but instead point a crooked finger and shout! “Heresy!”

Diverse Interpretations of Scripture

Add in to the mix the fact that the Bible, like the parables of Jesus, CAN, in fact, be understood in a variety of different ways with all of them being right (depending on the maturity and intellect and Holy Spirit working on the believer) and this fact makes a LOT of things we talk about in the Body NOT hills to die upon.

Let me give you an example. Water baptism. There are those who say water baptism is not necessary for salvation – and they will cite the biblical example of the thief on the cross . . . and they would be correct.

But then we might meet a believer who

Water Baptism and Diverse Beliefs

Might say something like, “Any real believer, devoted to Christ by faith will be baptized by water.” And they would be right too. And then we might have someone say that the water baptism has to be by immersion only – and citing Paul’s reasoning that the Christian water baptism is but a type for the believer being “buried with Christ and risen to new life,” and I think we could say that such a premise would be right too, and then . . .

We might have another believer suggest that water baptism by sprinkling is totally sufficient, and might throw in a story of how they received water baptism as a believer while living in a Nigerian desert where there wasn’t enough water to immerse them . . . and they would be right too. And these few examples are all just about one thing – water baptism.

Relative to biblical topics most positions and doctrines found in modern Christianity have support for being . . . right. I am convinced that God has allows for such diversity of thought and expression because there are so many factors involved when fallen man is seeking to reach and understand Holy God. We all arrive in the Body of Christ with different temperaments, intellects, passions, and spiritual gifts. We are talking about a highly diverse collection of individual parts orbiting around in a vast array of unique situations, experiences, and backgrounds.

Dogma and Religious Demands

Man has a tendency to try and bring order to these masses of diversity, and when it comes to religion this is frequently accomplished through dogma and religious demands that when placed before the scope of the ENTIRE Bible fail. But we allow them to exist (and even thrive) because they help make things work, and give us control, and effectively bring masses of diverse thinking people under the confines of one theological or religious roof.

So where God has allowed for a vast array of divergent thought to exist in and through conscientious study of His Word, men step in and say: “This is how it is” – “believe it.” “Do it.” And God’s means of bringing up babes in Christ right along with the mature believer, the artists up with the scientists, the liberals with the conservations, is lost.

Core Christian Tenets

This being said, there are some essential core issues to biblical Christianity on which we cannot give an inch. In my opinion (again, this list is also negotiable) but from what I can see and after appealing to the Bible, I would suggest that the non-negotiable essentials to Christianity are:

• Monotheism (or the belief that there is only one true and living God).
• The Deity of Jesus Christ (meaning He is God incarnate)
• The Gospel (or Good News) which is articulated in scripture as:

• Jesus died for sin
• He was buried
• He overcame the grave on the third day.

The reason this is the Good News is because He did it all, He overcame it all, and He is the author and finisher of it all.

• That human-kind is saved by grace through faith on Him and His finished work, and
• That there is no other way to receive a forgiveness of sin – He is the way, the Truth, and the Life.

There might be other issues people would add to my list – virgin birth (which I fully embrace) and some other things (like the Word of God is reliable for the Godly edification of Man) but when it comes to core Christian tenets, I’m gonna leave it here for a number of reasons too long to explain.

Now, in addition to these five core essentials there are thousands of other points of doctrine that can (and do) serve to get in the way of Christian love (as defined by 1st Corinthians 13). They have split churches, even broken up marriages, and divided those who embrace the essentials. Part of the blame lies in the natural of religious men and women which often seems to include the need to be right about everything, but this blame is equally shared with the clergy who have used non-essentials to divide, conquer and control congregates for centuries.

I mean believers in Christ have actually been put to death by believers in Christ because they possessed opinions differing from religious tradition on NON-ESSENTIAL doctrine and theology! Few things are more terrifying to see in another human being than a zealous, fanatical stance on a non-essential to the faith.

Now, stay with me.

Discussion on Non-Essentials

NON-ESSENTIALS certainly should be discussed and discerned – even debated – but in my opinion

Analysis of Mormonism Within Christian Doctrine

they ought to be allowed to exists within the hearts and minds of those who otherwise stand firm on the essentials. For this reason I would suggest that we give a pass to all five point Calvinists, Preterists, pre-tribulationists, Arminianists, and every other “ist” and “ism” who otherwise fully receive the essentials of Christ and Christianity. When it comes to Mormonism, it fails on the all but one of the five essentials I have proposed are founded on a contextual readingReading Scripture with attention to its audience, setting, and purpose—essential to fulfilled understanding. of the Bible.

Differences in Understanding God and Salvation

Theologically, they refuse Monotheism – no matter what they claim today. Monotheism does not fit with the LDS plan of Salvation. Neither does the deity of Christ – self-existent eternal God in the flesh, not the LDS Jesus. Where the LDS do agree with Christianity is on the third point – that he suffered for sin, was buried, and rose again on the third day. The problem is where the Bible summarizes these points by calling them the Gospel, Mormonism and Mormon people refer to “the Gospel” as ALL that Mormonism teaches. So even on the one point that they seem to agree with biblical Christianity, they differ.

They also differ on soteriology, or how a person is saved (which is a long discussion) and finally they refuse the notion that Jesus is the only way by which salvation comes because they have redefined salvation, and have even added LDS baptism to the things needed just to get it. All of this has been covered by us in-depth and can be viewed at www.hotm.tv.

My point is even on the essentials, Mormonism, as a self-proclaimed Christian faith, fails. But here’s the deal – let’s say, for arguments sake, that Mormonism was in complete agreement with the five essentials we’ve listed tonight (and removed any practice or doctrine that supported variance from them) we could and should receive them into the full fellowship of the Saints as readily as we accept and embrace Five Point Calvinists, Arminianists, pre-trib, post-trib and no trib believers.

Again, if the core doctrines are sound, I would suggest that we have a tremendous amount of leeway and latitude to believers who see, believe, and live Christianity in diverse ways.

The Influence of Calvinism on Joseph Smith

So why even address Calvinism if this is the case? When Joseph Smith supposedly “saw a need to restore Christianity to the earth” during his years of living in the burned over district of upstate New York, I would suggest that the tenets of Calvinism are what contributed to his disdain for the Christianity he saw around him. This disdain led Smith, with the help and insights of Oliver Cowdery and Sidney Rigdon, to create a new form of Christianity… from his superb mind and fanciful imagination.

Instead of responding to five point Calvinism using the Bible, Smith took the liberty of producing rational, reasonable, though unbiblical responses that made sense to those turned off by Calvinism’s theological propositions. Understandably so. Jesus himself said in Matthew 22:37

“Thou shalt love the Lord thy God with all thy heart, and with all thy soul, and with all thy mind.”

We love what and who we know – otherwise we are only loving what we want to believe someone or something is. It stands to reason then, that to love God, we must know Him. And knowing Him, we are commanded then to love Him – with all of our heart, and all of our souls, and all of our minds.

Those who encounter five point Calvinism and are repulsed by its tenets are eager to hear an alternative so they CAN honestly love God with all of their heart, soul, and mind. Joseph Smith gave them such an alternative. But it was NOT biblical.

In our coverage of Calvinism it is my hope to provide to the LDS a biblical alternative which will help them abandon the philosophies of Man, but at the same time love the Lord will ALL of their Heart, Soul, and Mind.

Hang on to thy hats, folks. Let’s open up the phone lines: